tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8983386.post7986521574152368409..comments2024-03-12T04:51:46.468-05:00Comments on Blue Gal: Sitting on the (virtual) Left Bank, watching the (class) war go by.Fran / Blue Galhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/18293627981248346055noreply@blogger.comBlogger19125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8983386.post-13152013603412568112009-03-25T02:59:00.000-05:002009-03-25T02:59:00.000-05:00I know I'm late to the party, but this is one of t...I know I'm late to the party, but this is one of the best things I've read since Billmon from the Whiskey Bar Days.<BR/><BR/>Thanks!!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8983386.post-18198867418514255962009-03-23T00:53:00.000-05:002009-03-23T00:53:00.000-05:00Just to be clear, while I was street poor for near...Just to be clear, while I was street poor for nearly four years, and nearly as poor for years after that, that was years ago (Ford, Carter, and Reagan were presidents.) Then during the dotcom boom (under Clinton) I was, briefly, barely, a paper millionaire. Now I'm solidly a bit below median income and, barring some pretty serious serendipidy, likely to stay there.<BR/><BR/>Anyway, when I said I didn't have much experience of contemporary poverty what I meant was that *when* I was homeless I was *so* bottom-out-of-sight (high-school dropout, long-haired hippy, wandering wastrel panhandler and street musician, low-end bar gopher) I didn't really have much experience of the kind of poverty facing people with families (possibly *single* with familes), below-waterline mortgages, uncertain job prospects, who couldn't just hang out their thumb because they heard there might be construction work in Atlanta, cannery work in Alaska, a street-vendor gig in the Bay Area, or a "donor center" in New England that paid double for selling blood plasma. In other words I had a lot of too-close-for-comfort experience of near-starvation vagabondage but not so much about the quiet-desperation culture of Nickled and Dimed.<BR/><BR/>Which is more about me than I'm usually comfortable disclosing... and may not be entirely relevant to the core of your very pointed, poignant post, Blue Gal.<BR/><BR/>Take care... and good luck to us all,<BR/><BR/>figleaffigleafhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01440982008394316977noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8983386.post-71785775981893212312009-03-22T22:03:00.000-05:002009-03-22T22:03:00.000-05:00The wiki on generation jones captures my feelings ...The wiki on generation jones captures my feelings about growing up beautifully.<BR/>I do still use jones. I despised the yuppy ethos.<BR/>I never took the bait for conservatism.<BR/><A HREF="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JIbp5C-5WXM" REL="nofollow">Here is my favorite use of jones</A>datacinehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00180201065349412771noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8983386.post-79092019233991856202009-03-22T17:23:00.000-05:002009-03-22T17:23:00.000-05:00BG I probably reacted strongly to the whole genera...BG I probably reacted strongly to the whole generational experience because of my geographical experience. The daughter of working class parents in a small (2000 people) working class community. My first awareness of anything political was John Kennedy's presidential campaign when he told us "ask not what your country can do for you, but what you can do for your country." A whole lot of us believed that.<BR/><BR/>In 2000 I was at an event in NH called College Convention 2000, where college students had an opportunity to ask questions of many of the candidates running for president. A consistent question was "what have you done for me?" Only John McCain had the courage to share the JFK quote with them, and challenge them to take action. This was before he sold his soul to the dark side.<BR/><BR/>I think every generation has included individuals who don't care about making money, who DO care about making money, who are greedy, or who want to give back to make the world a better place for everyone. <BR/><BR/><BR/>BACBAChttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04394238321236592123noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8983386.post-17678536551096244632009-03-22T13:34:00.000-05:002009-03-22T13:34:00.000-05:00That's very helpful, quietchaos, thanks.And BAC, y...That's very helpful, quietchaos, thanks.<BR/><BR/>And BAC, you would love K, the woman with all new schools. She joined the Peace Corps, travelled through Kenya, and met her husband at a Robert Bly/Iron John conference. She's a little blond Buddhist is a big house in the Boston suburbs, and she's too much. But I love her because of her AWARENESS of the 'too much' part of her generational experience.Fran / Blue Galhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18293627981248346055noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8983386.post-61661848825715244692009-03-22T11:19:00.000-05:002009-03-22T11:19:00.000-05:00best thing i've read in days. thanks.best thing i've read in days. thanks.Sherry Pasquarellohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06107407102753464356noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8983386.post-32031054541771106062009-03-22T11:18:00.000-05:002009-03-22T11:18:00.000-05:00Interesting blog and post, Blue Gal. But it’s miss...Interesting blog and post, Blue Gal. But it’s missing an important part of the equation...an important generational context to your comments, that is also relevant because you're 45 yourself: Generation Jones, born 1954-1965, between the Boomers and Generation X. Google Generation Jones, and you’ll see it’s gotten a ton of media attention, and many top commentators from many top publications and networks (Washington Post, Time magazine, NBC, Newsweek, ABC, etc.) now specifically use this term.<BR/><BR/>Here is a recent op-ed in USA TODAY about GenJones which is on point re. your article: <BR/>http://www.usatoday.com/printedition/news/20090127/column27_st.art.htmAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8983386.post-66373562671113524542009-03-21T22:34:00.000-05:002009-03-21T22:34:00.000-05:00BG, I wish I had a nickle for every time I've hear...BG, I wish I had a nickle for every time I've heard "<I>a whole big lot of 40 somethings don’t think Social Security will be there for them at all</I>" ... when I FIRST started hearing this it was in reference to 20-somethings. For more than 40 years I've heard this mantra and guess what? People are STILL receiving SS benefits.<BR/><BR/>Are we facing tough times now? You bet ... but EVERY generation has faced tough times ... and NO generation is perfect.<BR/><BR/>And I'd love to meet someone who went to a new school every year, because that's not my experience. <BR/><BR/>The jury is still out on Obama. I am hoping he succeeds, but it would be hard to argue that his most pressing issue is the economy, and does he even have his team in place?<BR/><BR/><BR/>BACBAChttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04394238321236592123noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8983386.post-3535225294885272952009-03-21T22:03:00.000-05:002009-03-21T22:03:00.000-05:00Fran, you know I love ya. When we say "companies ...Fran, you know I love ya. When we say "companies figured out" how to screw people in order to make more money, NO. <BR/><BR/>It wasn't companies. It was PEOPLE. MANAGERS. Fellow human beings came up with 401Ks, which forced workers who wanted retirement to save it in the stock market and KEEP it in the stock market or pay a penalty! I guess that's what I'm getting at. Phil Gramm said deregulating the financial industries was a great idea. He's not a company, he was an elected representative of US. <BR/><BR/>If we don't learn that lesson, we are really screwed, not just financially.Fran / Blue Galhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18293627981248346055noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8983386.post-25405951597207618082009-03-21T21:56:00.001-05:002009-03-21T21:56:00.001-05:00The Boomer generation coming into retirement are t...The Boomer generation coming into retirement are the ones who lived in the era where companies figured out how to pull the rug out from employees, pensions were scrapped, full time jobs with benefits were replaced with part time work @ 39.9 hours so as to avoid giving benefits. Whatever they were able to scrimp & stash into a 401k was just ravished by Wall Street's grand fuck ups (still waiting for the arrests)...<BR/>Add to this Social Security has been grossly mismanaged, the volume of people coming into retirement age, all create the perfect storm. <BR/>Oh! and modern medicine has figured out ways to allow people to live much longer-- sometimes a quantity vs quality issue.... and believe me when I say elder care ain't cheap. <BR/><BR/>We are sooooo screwed!Franhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14198689517878201943noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8983386.post-49998477051802297932009-03-21T21:56:00.000-05:002009-03-21T21:56:00.000-05:00And yet it's no "coincidence" that Obama was born ...And yet it's no "coincidence" that Obama was born after 1960? Not based on that analysis.<BR/><BR/>I wasn't discussing Carter's style, just his motivation, which is what the sentence I quoted was referring to. His Administration was ineffectual at least partly because he lacked the ability to deal well with other opinions. He had a reputation as a micromanager, which I haven't had much reason to disagree with. His activities since he left office were in many ways a continuation of what he tried to do while he was President. There was little for him to "get" there.<BR/><BR/>His behavior toward the Bushes at the Coretta Scott King funeral shows he still has the spite thing going, too.<BR/><BR/>Clinton, on the other hand, was very good at intellectual inclusion, and seemed to do a somewhat better job of delegating. Considering that Clinton had a Republican Congress to work with for most of his time in office, and that they did their best to remove him from office for no good reason, he was pretty effective.<BR/><BR/>The ways that Obama reminds me of Clinton are both eerie and sobering. Both are brilliant, with minds that are curious and intellectually voracious. They're married to accomplished women. Unfortunately, both have demonstrated an urge to go with the flow, no matter where that might lead. I'd be afraid of Bill Clinton being President right now, and had serious doubts about Hillary Clinton for the same reason. To me, that doesn't bode well for the next few years.<BR/><BR/>Hopefully, the times will make the man, as they sometimes do. If they do, though, it won't be the first time. Did someone mention Woodrow Wilson? ;) Harry Truman would be another inspirational example, I suppose.<BR/><BR/>What really makes me react so negatively, though, is that I heard all this same sort of talk from Boomers when we were young. I thought it was nonsense then, and still do. Each generation has its own problems to face, and different cultural influences. Each can be self-absorbed and petty, or altruistic and cooperative, depending what's demanded of it.Cujo359https://www.blogger.com/profile/10385213658828021737noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8983386.post-22172168686691270292009-03-21T21:43:00.000-05:002009-03-21T21:43:00.000-05:00Righteously great rant. I too am the voluntary po...Righteously great rant. I too am the voluntary poor and paying close attention. I just wish I were doing it in Canada. I live in the garage so I can rent the house so I can keep writing. But I do worry that I'll run out of possible renters when everyone loses their jobs.<BR/><BR/>I am, however, a filthy hippy boomer.Utah Savagehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16385093247915560752noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8983386.post-666593805027867852009-03-21T20:02:00.000-05:002009-03-21T20:02:00.000-05:00Also Cujo, Clinton and Carter never had the cahone...Also Cujo, Clinton and Carter never had the cahones to hold parlimentary style conferences with reports from Senators on small group meetings addressing things like...spending. Carter, who has clearly learned since the 70's, was so vindictive as President that he wouldn't have shared the stage with many congressmen at all. Clinton threw away his chances lots of times in lots of ways, as we all know, mostly based on arrogance. It's okay to hold those Democrats up as examples of Democratic leadership, but as using power to accomplish deep change, they failed. The jury will be out on Obama for years to come.Fran / Blue Galhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18293627981248346055noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8983386.post-63877947537028848302009-03-21T19:57:00.000-05:002009-03-21T19:57:00.000-05:00Cujo I tried to be clear in this post that there a...Cujo I tried to be clear in this post that there are Boomers who get it. But there is so much unacknowledged privilege in that enormous generation. My friend who was born in 1946 pointed out to me that every single time she grew old enough to change schools there was a brand new school building waiting for her. She was always the first in her school building through the 12th GRADE. <BR/><BR/>I'm tired of Atlantic magazine authors telling all of us. from both generations, that lifestyle choice trumps real class issues. It doesn't.Fran / Blue Galhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18293627981248346055noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8983386.post-72084801827556074932009-03-21T19:28:00.000-05:002009-03-21T19:28:00.000-05:00Well, get this: he does care about power, but only...<I>Well, get this: he does care about power, but only to the extent that power will help him accomplish something. He was born after 1960. Coincidence? I think not.</I><BR/><BR/>That's what Bill Clinton was after, and Jimmy Carter. That's Boomer and WWII generation, BTW.<BR/><BR/>GenXers didn't write <I>The Corporation</I> or <I>Zen Of Motorcycle Maintenance</I>. There have been power-hungry people in every generation of the last century at least, and plenty of people who called them out for what they are.<BR/><BR/>So yes, it's just coincidence.<BR/><BR/>qwerty, I think it's a shame what's happened to the music industry in the last twenty years. Music used to be fun. But attributing the term "classic rock" to "Lousy self-centered boomers" is just as self-righteously masturbational as the most self-righteously masturbational thing my generation's ever done. There was "classic" music before we came along.<BR/><BR/>Don't worry, you guys will get to be your own kind of assholes. Some of you are clearly already there.Cujo359https://www.blogger.com/profile/10385213658828021737noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8983386.post-66925929631366559702009-03-21T18:11:00.000-05:002009-03-21T18:11:00.000-05:00I am on my (virtual) feet applauding.Re the boomer...I am on my (virtual) feet applauding.<BR/><BR/>Re the boomers, did you ever notice that in the radio world, it used to be that when a piece of popular music reached the age of 10 or 15 years it was dubbed an "oldie". That is, until the boomers' music reached that age. That's when we got "classic rock."<BR/><BR/>Lousy self-centered boomers.qwertyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13034964906035978001noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8983386.post-59964341872808089062009-03-21T17:20:00.000-05:002009-03-21T17:20:00.000-05:00This was a great article, thanks for writing it. I...This was a great article, thanks for writing it. <BR/><BR/>I love how people who have never been poor a day in their lives write about some rose-colored world of clothes swapping and goodwill hunting (see what I did there? lol) like it's some sort of day trip from the Hamptons.<BR/><BR/>It's so insulting to those of us that really are poor. That have to choose between medication and food. That have to decide if we can afford a whole gallon of milk. Now is some of that situation our own doing? Sure, but is it anymore our fault than it is theirs? I worked for a doctor for YEARS that made assloads of money. I didn't see a raise for 3 years and was only making $10.50 after 6 1/2 years of toiling. But well, he needed a new Lexus. <BR/><BR/>This status idea is such utter bullshit. That piece about people who don't make $250,000 couldn't possibly manage the jobs that these AIG fucks have is really infuriating. It's obvious that all that is required for those jobs is the ability to bullshit and the lack of a soul. <BR/><BR/>I don't know guess I'm a bit off track here, but this idea that just because someone calls themselves a CEO and makes a six figure income makes them something to look up to makes me ill.Nickihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06580405858429794797noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8983386.post-79820308089407501132009-03-21T16:20:00.000-05:002009-03-21T16:20:00.000-05:00Love, love, LOVE this post! Loved it enough to com...Love, love, LOVE this post! Loved it enough to come out of lurking!Suzi Riothttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02869448922051303723noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8983386.post-17073279133994129422009-03-21T14:06:00.000-05:002009-03-21T14:06:00.000-05:00'bourgeois bohemians'...? What the f*ck color is B...<I>'bourgeois bohemians'</I>...? What the f*ck color is Brooksie's parachute? That's like 'liberal fascism' - a dichotomous contrast that only makes sense in the mind of one whose cognitive dissonance is ringing like a four-alarm firehouse bell.<BR/><BR/>I've been a broke-ass <I>real</I> boho most all of my purple life, sadly by deceit and to some degree design - So I just deal, using whatever freedom and imagination brings to hand.<BR/><BR/>Arianna had me, but she couldn't keep me because I believe in truth and her minions felt that it made their phony-baloney jobs in need of justification. S'okay, the pay was shite and there was no room for vertical career enhancement anyway.<BR/><BR/>To Hell with the co-opters. They can't give me back what their ways took from the commonweal, and discomfiting their status quo is like Christmas morning for me.<BR/><BR/>;>)darkblackhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06584075324283109495noreply@blogger.com