Posted this story to Daily Kos and immediately got 8 or 9 comments asking me to delete my post because CapitolBlue is not a reliable source, fwiw. Standing by my own comments, though.
I thought that impeachment was an extremist position, that it would do more harm to the country than good. I've changed my mind. Impeach. Impeach.
Here's why. If this story is true, we are in the hands of a dangerous, dangerous fascist.
Update and...correction?
ACLU lawyer says this quote is probably apocryphal. It's too much like Hitler's comment on the Versailles Treaty. Blue Gal's hoax-o-meter tipped into the red zone when she thought that, perhaps, the article linked above was unsigned? Lemme check. Nope, it's signed, and the author stands behind what he says, and takes a nice swipe at his detractors, here.
I think what Kathy says below is true. If he did say it, his supporters will just go into spin mode and say what he meant was that the Constitution can't get in the way of the security of all Americans. 'Course, we know what Ben Franklin had to say about that.
And if Bill Clinton had been suspected of saying such a thing, as an alleged comment, which I still think this is, folks, alleged, you can bet Rush Limbaugh would spend 90 minutes repeating the alleged quote and getting his ditto-heads all riled up, Sean Hannity would ask every guest on his show if they agreed with Clinton's alleged smear on the Constitution, Ann Coulter would swish her hair and get all mad about the threat our own President makes to America etc. etc.
What this administration is doing at Gitmo is as much a smear on the Constitution as anything he might have said. And I'm with Abby: I want him not to have said it. We are not going to lose this war on the lying sacks of Republicans, folks.
By the way, I got the original story from Alicia. Sorry I didn't hat tip earlier, girlfriend. xoxo
Yup. And he swore to protect and defend that goddamned piece of paper. I assume he wouldn't say that about the book his right hand was on when he swore that oath.
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ReplyDeleteAre there any corroborating stories to this? Mark linked me to this story last night... here is the line that bothered me in terms of story credibility: "I’ve talked to three people present for the meeting that day and they all confirm that the President of the United States called the Constitution “a goddamned piece of paper.”
ReplyDeleteIt's weird. I want Bush to have said this. I also want him NOT to have said this.
And thanks for the link on the Kos post. Nice one.
I'm afraid Bush could say this on national television, and his supporters would still say the blow job was worse. After all, it involved sex. This is just Bush's way of fighting the "terrists", so it must be okay. Uh huh.
ReplyDeleteImpeach Bush, but I would argue that we've got to strengthen ourselves before we can even begin to pull down a President.
ReplyDeleteHere's how I see it.
Many people say, "Well, you can't begin to love anyone else until you love yourself".
Or we UUs say, "We respect the inherent worth and dignity of all people."
And these ideals sound great...sound like a Hallmark card greeting. But until you begin to take them seriously, you've missed the point entirely.
I felt like a total misfit in my own life. Thus, I drifted to a group of UUs who would accept me for the way I am: queer, liberal, activist, goal-oriented, intellectual, et al. And there's a kind of conceit among all activists (of which we UUs tend to be) that presumes that I know better than you know and you ought to believe what I believe because I know what's best for you.
And there's a part of me who gets frustrated when people don't recycle, or shop at Walmart, or buy into all of those myths that people, in an attempt to make as much money as possible, have put in place to sell more product. But do I really have any right pointing all of these things out? Do they really accomplish anything? Sometimes I wonder if it is an exercise in futility to presume that can change the minds of anyone...even if they're like me. Can I really bring my version of "the truth" to someone whose mind may or may not be open the way I'd like?
I've put myself around a bunch of people who were broken in all the same ways I was broken, but were doing nothing to get away from their own issues. Many of them, unfortunately, were also UUs.
My personal belief is that many people can't be strong for themselves. They can't create their own energy, so they steal from other people. I've often mistaken true friends for users. I thought their interest from me was to help me out, but really all they wanted was to steal my energy...if not material goods.
Until you're secure in yourself, I don't think you can help being an energy stealer. And there's a part of being young and confused that lends itself to this sort of phenomenon.
In my own life, I have often been--much to my own dismay, a person highly critical of others. And I'll I'm really saying or pointing out are the problems I have within myself that may or may not be present in other people.
And I, too, have been an energy thief.
The friendships and relationship partners I seek to find are those who won't steal my energy, or I won't feel tempted to steal from them. I seek mutually beneficial relationships where we both help each other understand something about ourselves that we didn't know before, and in doing so, help each other love ourselves in the process.
And until we can be strong for all the right reasons...and not to serve our own selfish purposes...then my fear is that we'll just put a puppet up there who will be just as manipulative and self-serving...just OUR sort of self-serving.
So many people do the right things for the wrong reasons.
And if we are intent on ending the reign of George the First...we ought to find a replacement who can be strong enough to piss us off at times...for the right reasons.
Impeach.
ReplyDeleteBoy, Kevin--that sure is some windy crap you're talking. Bush needs to be impeached, not because we liberals are selfish, but because he is a criminal. The replacement lined up for the post-impeachment USA is an immaterial concern at this point. Ridding the nation of Bush would not occur without the removal of the real Criminal-in-Chief, Dick Cheney, as they are both complicit in the same crimes.
ReplyDeleteBush is a domestic criminal who has put the final touches on the slow death of American democracy. Whether destroying the last shreds of integrity in the electoral process or lying to the US Congress about the necessity of Hussein's removal and starting a unilateral war against an unconquerable people, his crimes as President are without precedent. He needs to be impeached now, today, this fucking minute.
What is most ironic about this pseudo-religious secret alcoholic's campaign for US world domination is that it has so many adherents...Americans of both political inclinations need to see that involving this nation in the governance of others is wrong in any circumstance. It is a complete and total contradiction of the ideals that helped create this nation. Democracies should never be empires. And as much as I hate to say it, Bush is not wholly responsible for the mess we are in right now--it grows out of the USA's arrogant assumption of the role of world leader in the days after World War II; it grows out of the ruins of Vietnam and other foreign policies designed to subjugate humanity to the interests of First World corporations.
Lastly, I'm not really sure what point you are trying to make, Kevin. The history of human government clearly shows that respecting human dignity has never been a major concern of those who exercise power. If you in your idealistic cocoon wait for the confluence of government and human decency you will be waiting forever...and with GW Bush running the world's largest army and nuclear arsenal the rest of us do not have that kind of time.
I really have to agree with you, Beege. I think it's way past time to evict the squatters. As the facts are coming out, even the bought-and-paid-for (or intimidated) MSM has to give them some sort of recognition. We need to get rid of the whole neocon cabal, of whom Dubya is a pathetic and moronic puppet, but a mean-spirited and cruel one at that. America is not best served by the theory of continual war in order to 'dominate' the world unilaterally. And enriching the oil, defense and other corporate interests in the process. These are the two powers that have teamed up to control the United States, and we have to become aware of the real reasons that this horror is going on.
ReplyDeleteBecause of everything I have come to know about the Resident, I give that story a certain amount of credibility. His actions support it if nothing else, like you say.
ReplyDeleteI'd love it not to be true - I'd also love it if there had been a President Gore like the American people voted for; I'd love it if we were not at war illegally with a coun try incapable of harming us. I'd love a lot of things, but most of all, I'd love for the Resident and his neocon puppet-masters gone.
That's what I want for Christmas.
Idealistic? Nah. Windy? Maybe so.
ReplyDeleteJust practical.
The point is this, and has always been this...what was it Comrade Jesus said...you can't remove the speck from your brother's eye before you remove the plank from your own.
And quite frankly, as I see it, we will continue to perpetuate the sort of arrogance you rightly pointed out in which we are all to blame.
The world is not based on fairy tales and Disney Movies...but I do believe that what goes around comes around. If we impeach the Prez and his underlings, it would be just as destructive to put a whole new government in that would be just as evil...just our sort of evil.
This, of course, assumes that all of us are not so jaded by own own post-modern ennui that we think we might be able to change things for the better and that we might actually start living up to the IDEALISTIC precepts this country was founded on.
I mean, 'cause ultimately, if we don't do it...then no one else will.
Someone's got to take the moral high ground...and someone's got to call bullshit for the right reasons...not the wrong ones.
Even if the story is NOT true, we're in the hands of a dangerous, dangerous fascist.
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