Thank you for participating, and for your open-mindedness and love toward this little Christian housewife. (Sent Mr. BG off this morning with this statement: "Okay honey, I'll remember! Ban, toothpaste, pharmacy, and drycleaning! Love you!)
Here's something paraphrased from some earlier posts, but which really say what I want to say.
So often I talk or email with fellow lefties who have just had it with the religious right to the point that they can't stand Christianity or even religion in general. It's as if there is such a slippery slope in their minds between any admission of faith and total fundamentalism that it's just not worth it to go down that path. No religion is better than any religion, because in the end we all become Pat Robertson or Al Qaeda.
I'm actually quite sympathetic to those lefties who think they hate Christianity. Funny thing is when you engage these lefties in conversation, a great many of them think Jesus was a cool guy, and some actually revere him. Even those who reject Christianity outright are not nearly so angry as they let on.
Let me point something out here, again. Jesus of Nazareth was nailed to a tree by the political and religious CONSERVATIVES of his day because they mistakenly thought they had power and that he threatened that power. ANY Christian, myself included, who thinks they would have rescued Jesus from the cross, that certainly WE wouldn't have gone along with Pilate and Judas and abandoned him like Peter, are just kidding themselves. And those right-wingers who think they're really serving the cause of Jesus by electing Republicans, or working to make America a "Christian" nation? Heh, and once again, Mr. BG suggests I stop saying "fuck" on this blog.
It's that the religious right/Republican Party has so often set the discourse that "God/Jesus equals us" that some of us lefties tend to believe that. Rejecting hate speech, intolerance, and fundamentalism becomes rejecting all religion.
But see, I love Jesus, and I'm strongly committed to making sure YOUR right NOT to believe is protected. I also believe, while we're at it, that I would be SINNING against my God to attempt to convert you. That's His provence. And if I believe (and I struggle to, at least) that God is Love and that God loves his creation, I think smart, funny, gifted non-believing bloggers have one of the better tables at Divine Love's cocktail party. You certainly do at mine.
Here's the deal about Christians, though. We're not all Pat Robertson, and I refuse to allow the Religious Right to define what Christianity is, for me, or for my readership.
Blog against Theocracy is this weekend.
And also by the way, I'm honored to be guest blogging today over at the First Freedom First blog (it's a repeat of the initial blogswarm post, but still). Wow. What an honor.
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you put it very well.
ReplyDeletewe all walk different paths.
I heartily agree. The argument you cite describes two forms of extremism.
ReplyDeletetheocracy nailed jesus to the cross
ReplyDeletelove you, BG! we're with you on this one, bigtime.
Whenever I leave a comment on this site, I have to enter my password and word verification at least three times.
ReplyDeleteMany of the non-believing lefties to whom you refer view religious “moderates” as extremist enablers. It is only recently that some liberal Christians have begun to stand up to the fundies, and more recent still that some fundies have stood up for truly biblical causes like stewardship of the environment. This is way, way overdue and too little too late for many non-believers. Even many believers refuse to participate in organized religion for fear of inadvertently supporting some charlatan, even in the “normal” churches; they’ve lost faith in their faith.
ReplyDeleteIt’s analogous to the police brutality issue: Now that some middle class white folks are getting their skulls cracked, suddenly they care about police brutality. Similarly, now that we are mired in an interminable & illegal war and the world hates us, suddenly “normal” Christians want to stand up to the fundies. It’s like closing the barn door and saying, “oopth” after the horse gets out.
Still, it’s heartening to see so many Christians standing up for the separation clause. I just wish they had done it sooner – like back in the 50s.
The 1850s.
If they had, maybe now we wouldn’t have a smirking, coke-addled “born-again Christian” in the fucking White House.
I'm in, Beege! Great idea that needs to be hollered about.
ReplyDeleteI got so sick of trying to find a Christian church that reflected and practiced my values that some musician friends and I started our own in a little theater space. One of us is an ordained minister, and the rest of us play in the band and bring doughnuts. I've never had a church home before, but now I look forward to Sunday mornings, even after a late gig Sat nite!
What the theocrats don't understand is that separation of church and state protects their religious freedom too!
Amen!!! (And I never use that term...but it fits today)
ReplyDeletePersonally, I am so tired of the right assuming that they own God--which is a mistake that Israel in the OT made all too often, often forcing God to go all righteous on their a**es. Jesus came to throw down the powers that be, but not in the way we humans thought it would be...the Saducees used God as a step stool to power, and the Pharisees used God to reinforce just how "right" and "perfect" they were. Both of which Jesus rejected.
Personally, I think God has a big problem when we swear allegience to a flag, a type of idol. I think he wants nothing to do with being on our money, and short of being involved in our justice system, to see true justice done,....wait, I better stop before I start a rant and go on for hours!
Good job!
Here's the deal about Christians, though. We're not all Pat Robertson, and I refuse to allow the Religious Right to define what Christianity is...
ReplyDeleteWell, yeah. And sometimes, when I talk to - or blog with - my non-believing friends, I can't quite figure out why it's so hard to get them to see that. Umm, not to put myself on that altar, but, ever notice how many of the leaders of the civil rights movement were/are MINISTERS? And don't get me started on Alice Paul... Have to save the rest for my own post!
And big daddy has a point there: The Muslim folks I know will tell you straight up that the bombers and beheaders don't represent them, and certainly NOT their faith, but many of them feel they have a good reason to stay silent. American Christians? No good reason. Silence means surrender. Time to start taking our jesus back.
I passed along the links to the Jesus Che-rist graphic and this post to my minister boyfriend.
ReplyDeleteSigned - An atheist blogging against theocracy this weekend.
"theocracy nailed jesus to the cross" - t(h)om
ReplyDeleteI say that loudly and often, T(h)om. And QD, it's great to see you express your sentiments in a present-tense, active way. As they say, "Give'er!"
Blue Gal, I'm a Christian at heart who has deplored organized religion for decades now. But many of your posts (and QDave's as well) put lucid words to my conflicted emotions so well that, dare I say it, you have me thinking about finding a local church-unit to hook up with. I hear the Unitarians hereabouts are protesting the Iraq war on the town common every Saturday...
That was a wonderful and awesome post.
ReplyDeleteCLAP, CLAP, CLAP!
ReplyDeleteAs you know, I'm a non-believer of the omnipotent deified variety. I always try to separate religion from the concept of a God or morals or any other concept that is a personal choice. To me, believing or not believing is a little like being gay. It is who you are and it ain't nobody else's business.
Thanks for doing the God's (and the Bright's) work. We're all better for it.
Now I'm going to fill out that form to have you beatified. I'll let you know when it's in the mail.
Blue Gal, I'm a humanist not for rejection of the teachings of Christ, but for the disgust felt towards those who aspire to power in the name of religion.
ReplyDeleteCunning: Give those UU's a try. Good peeps.
ReplyDeleteAlways, George? Always? Sad to hear that, but I'm getting used to it...
ReplyDeleteHey! I just realized that the picture you posted is FOX News Jesus! He is facing left, though.
ReplyDeleteMy thoughts on the whole "Christian" mindset is that many think that by labeling themselves "Christian" they, by proxy, "believe" and will skip the whole burning and gnashing bit.
ReplyDeleteMy problem is with organized religion or what I call "cultism". The right-wing Christians love to throw around the term "gang mentality" when it comes to groups of Latino Americans and/or African Americans, but when it comes to their own consuming horde mentality they excuse it away with a grand fart of hubris.
I would never dream of interfering with their beliefs, the opposite, in nearly 90% of the cases, is never so. They feel obligated to convert you to their thinking. Converting TO or FOR God is, in my opinion, the greatest experiment in insecurity I've ever witnessed.
A theocracy we sure as hell don't need.
Pseudo-christians: Anti-abortion, anti-gay-marriage, anti-homosexual, pro-death-penalty, and pro-war... just who the hell do they think they're fooling? The only answer I can think of is- themselves.
"F" BASED FAITH
Dead in the noisy church, in the
Universe of God, everyone's departed.
Down into the impartial ground
Old Christian men, women, dry-
Dried up bones left low in the world,
Empty souled dust and deceit
Writhing now evermore.
Hush! Not a pious sound!
Dead in the noisy worship, in the
universe of God, everyone's deceased.
Twisting expressions, scornful mouths,
Shush thy hastening there along the pew,
Under the baptism’s ocean, the green
grin of tooth-filled trickery under plush
dresses, pink skirts and flowery hats,
The posh suits, ties and gold and bursting coffers
and thy organ’s droning hell coiled to serpent’s tongue,
Hush thy kowtowing mouths! Hush!
Dead in the noisy church, in the
Universe of God, everyone's departed.
Lifeless in the cathedral,
Rotting in the hymnals,
The congregational affirmations,
Reverend, monk, priest and preacher
Calling out to thy listless sinnings
And the lick of flaming damnation.
Hush now! Hush now! Hush now!
Shush thy mouths and keenly listen,
God has something to say now
and with all your blather and spin
you might miss the truth within,
so hush thy "f" based-faith mouth...
Dead in the noisy worship, in the
Universe of God, everyone's deceased.
Copyright © 2006 mrp / thepoetryman
Wow, that is probably the most intelligent post I've ever read from a Christian about Jesus and religious liberty. I'm going to try to come up with a post for this weekends event. Oh and I'll be visiting here again. You rock, Blue Gal
ReplyDeleteBrilliantly written, Blue Gal!
ReplyDeleteI'm all linked up and rarin' to go. Brought All Things Democrat along for the ride.
Thank you.
"ANY Christian, myself included, who thinks they would have rescued Jesus from the cross, that certainly WE wouldn't have gone along with Pilate and Judas and abandoned him like Peter, are just kidding themselves."
ReplyDeleteI don't know, BlueGal, you seem to be doing your own version of rescuing him right now.
Good for you.
~Atheist admirer.
I have no problem with Jesus, I mean, except for his Messiah complex. Haha. And also the fact that seems to have harbored some contemporary prejudices, which is to be expected: "Even a stupid Samaritan knows who his neighbor is." He's trying to illustrate the Golden Rule, which as far as I can tell is pretty much a universal principle among religions. This, of course, leads me to wonder whether or not this principle is hardwired into our brains. Notions of reciprocity predate the big JC, like, say, with the Greeks (I'm thinking specifically of their propensity toward hospitality, which is played out in The Oddessy and is the premise for a righteous butt-kicking!). In which case, it would be wrong to claim that Jesus created anything new when he came up with the "Do unto others...", since it was already there. It would be like me taking credit for the infield-fly rule. Hm. I think I got off my train of thought a few stops too early. Sigh.
ReplyDeleteHJ
Happy Jihad's House of Pancakes